Mike Belshe [ARCHIVE] / is on Nostr

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🗓️ Active from 2013-11-15 to 2014-04-15
💬 Posted a total of 5 messages
📚 Participated in the following categories: Bitcoin-development, unSYSTEM
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2023-06-07 15:18:37

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📅 Original date posted:2014-04-15
📝 Original message:For what it is worth, I found btcd (the go implementation of bitcoind) has
much better error/diagnostics messages. It would have given you more than
"-22 TX Rejected". I used it to debug my own multi-sig transactions and it
was very helpful.
Mike
On Tue, Apr 15, 2014 at 8:42 AM, Matt Whitlock <bip at mattwhitlock.name>wrote:
> On Tuesday, 15 April 2014, at 5:30 pm, Mike Hearn wrote:
> > >
> > > That's so weird, though, because we haven't been able to get anything
> to
> > > accept the transaction, seemingly, and yet it was accepted into the
> block
> > > chain 15 blocks ago.
> >
> >
> > If the tx is already in the block chain then it won't be accepted again,
> > because it would be double spending itself!
>
> Haha, yes, I know that. But we had been trying to get a 2-of-3 to be
> accepted by something for hours, and everything was rejecting it: Coinb.in,
> our local Bitcoind, the Eligius tx push form. Evidently something did
> accept it and we didn't notice. We're starting over again now and trying to
> reproduce the success (or failure).
>
>
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2023-06-07 15:18:37

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2023-06-07 15:16:13

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📅 Original date posted:2014-03-27
📝 Original message:On Wed, Mar 26, 2014 at 6:01 PM, Alan Reiner <etotheipi at gmail.com> wrote:
> This might be tangential, but the comment about "refund" chains reminded
> me. Armory will be implementing multi-sig/linked wallets where a each
> device has a parallel HDW branch and produces P2SH addresses. For those
> types of wallets, I plan to allocate two chains *per signing authority*.
> If you have a shared 2-of-2 wallet split between your phone and your
> spouse's phone, your phone would distribute addresses on P2SH chain 0 and
> generate change addresses on P2SH chain 1. Your spouse's phone would use
> chains 2 and 3.
>
> So if you and your spouse switch to a new app that supports M-of-N linked
> wallets, it should search for coin history along the first 2*N chains.
>
In general with multisig, we should probably discourage using a common root
keychain for multiple keys in the same P2SH address. The reason is because
if you have the single, root private key, you can sign them all. This
generally goes against the point of multisig - which was trying to
introduce a system which had multiple keys required to unlock :-)
For the BitGo BIP32 implementation we are doing the following:
- users create 2 extended keys
- bitgo creates 1 extended key for that user
- the user can create any number of separate branches (accounts) of P2SH
addresses from those extended keys.
- change/public addresses are generated from the 0/1 branches
- new addresses are generated from there.
- each time a new change address is generated, all 3 keys in the P2SH
are rotated. This makes it so that for any chain depth *i* of the P2SH
address, we're using the *i*th key in each keychain. For privacy reasons,
we don't need to rotate all keys. But I think it makes management simpler
and probably more ready for interop.
So the paths in a user's keychain look exactly like BIP32's layout:
m/<AccountIndex>/<ExternalOrInternal>/<AddressIndex>
Another issue unique to P2SH addresses is order of the keys. There has been
talk in this list of how to sort them. While sorting is simplifying for
interop if you never use new change addresses, I believe sorting makes
wallet management more difficult when BIP32 is introduced.
Specifically, imagine a P2SH address with keys held by Bob, Charlie, and
Dana. If you sort the pubkeys, then with each BIP32 chain, the order of
the keys could be different. By maintaining key order, we always know
which of the pubkeys belongs to which user without having to do any lookups.
Obviously this can all be calculated too. But the sorting seems gratuitous
to me - it adds complexity but offers little value. On the other hand, it
can be really handy to know that key #0 for this address is always Bob's
key, regardless of how deep the chaining goes.
Mike
>
> -Alan
>
>
>
>
> On 03/26/2014 07:37 PM, Andreas Schildbach wrote:
>
> Thanks for starting the discussion on finding a better structure.
>
> For me, the most important thing is either we're 100% interoperable or
> 0%. There should not be anything inbetween, as users will delete seeds
> without knowing there is still money in them on another implementation.
> I heard from multiple sources that using this standard some wallets will
> only see a subset of the addresses/keys of some other wallets.
> Implementation differences can always happen (and should addresses as
> bugs), but I think its unacceptable that this source of issues is by design.
>
> I suggest we agree on an even simpler least common denominator and
> wallets that want to implement some feature on top of that can do but
> are encouraged to pick a totally different "cointype". I guess that
> would mean removing reserved and account.
>
> I'm still thinking it might be a good idea to have a separate chain for
> "refunds". Refunds will be rarely used and thus need a much slower
> moving window than receiving addresses or change.
>
>
> On 03/26/2014 09:49 PM, Mike Hearn wrote:
>
> Myself, Thomas V (Electrum) and Marek (Trezor) got together to make sure
> our BIP32 wallet structures would be compatible - and I discovered that
> only I was planning to use the default structure.
>
> Because I'm hopeful that we can get a lot of interoperability between
> wallets with regards to importing 12-words paper wallets, we
> brainstormed to find a structure acceptable to everyone and ended up with:
>
> /m/cointype/reserved'/account'/change/n
>
> The extra levels require some explanation:
>
> * cointype: This is zero for Bitcoin. This is here to support two
> things, one is supporting alt coins based off the same root seed.
> Right now nobody seemed very bothered about alt coins but sometimes
> feature requests do come in for this. Arguably there is no need and
> alt coins could just use the same keys as Bitcoin, but it may help
> avoid confusion if they don't.
>
> More usefully, cointype can distinguish between keys intended for
> things like multisig outputs, e.g. for watchdog services. This means
> if your wallet does not know about the extra protocol layers
> involved in this, it can still import the "raw" money and it will
> just ignore/not see the keys used in more complex transactions.
>
> * reserved is for "other stuff". I actually don't recall why we ended
> up with this. It may have been intended to split out multisig
> outputs etc from cointype. Marek, Thomas?
>
> * account is for keeping essentially wallets-within-a-wallet to avoid
> mixing of coins. If you want that.
>
> * change is 0 for receiving addresses, 1 for change addresses.
>
> * n is the actual key index
>
> For bitcoinj we're targeting a deliberately limited feature set for hdw
> v1 so I would just set the first three values all to zero and that is a
> perfectly fine way to be compatible.
>
> The goal here is that the same seed can be written down once, and meet
> all the users needs, whilst still allowing some drift between what
> wallets support.
>
> Pieter made the I think valid point that you can't really encode how
> keys are meant to be used into just an HDW hierarchy and normally you'd
> need some metadata as well. However, I feel interop between wallets is
> more important than arriving at the most perfect possible arrangement,
> which feels a little like bikeshedding, so I'm happy to just go with the
> flow on this one.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
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>
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2023-06-07 15:16:13

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2023-06-07 15:11:08

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📅 Original date posted:2013-12-27
📝 Original message:Great!
There is another one at http://testnet.btclook.com/ which provides a
different view as well.
Mike
On Fri, Dec 27, 2013 at 10:05 AM, Mike Hearn <mike at plan99.net> wrote:
> For a long time the only block explorer for testnet has been the original
> blockexplorer.com, which is unfortunately often broken / behind / slow
> and not really maintained any more.
>
> There is now a new one, here:
>
> https://www.biteasy.com/testnet/blocks
>
> There's also a REST/JSON API for it.
>
> Please note one curiosity of this block explorer is that the coinbase tx
> doesn't necessarily come first in the listing (it's sorted by "time
> received", see).
>
> Other interesting thing to note: this site is built using bitcoinj. The
> author can be contacted on IRC sometimes using the nick damethos.
>
>
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2023-06-07 15:11:08

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2023-06-07 15:10:54

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📅 Original date posted:2013-12-19
📝 Original message:Hey Peter -
I think this is a super list. A couple of thoughts:
a) In the section on multi-sig and multi-factor, I think we can split these
apart. Multi-factor user authentication is very valuable and not the same
as multi-factor signing, which is a second level of complexity. The
multi-factor auth can be off-blockchain, e.g. authenticating with SMS
message to your phone or Google Authenticator challenge. Given the state
of malware today, I personally would propose two requirements:
1) wallets SHOULD use multi-factor authentication before authorizing
access to a wallet (e.g. view balances, addresses, transactions, etc)
2) wallets MUST use multi-factor auth before signing a transaction.
[note: I recognize that MUST might be too aggressive right now, but I
wouldn't use a wallet without it. this can also be impractical for
server-side wallets]
b) Multi-factor signing (e.g. P2SH) may be too early to really define. But
here are some issues which have come up from my own personal development
experience:
- Wallets SHOULD NOT create two keys on a single host or device
- Wallets SHOULD provide a way to import external public keys which can
be used as part of a P2SH address
Slightly off topic: For P2SH, address creation requires the public key,
not the public hash of an address. For me, this has made it difficult to
import keys created through out-of-band sources. Most wallets/key
generators/etc only provide the address and not the public key, and this is
a hinderance to easy P2SH creation off host. It would be great if there
were a way to address this, but I don't know how.
c) Small word-choice nit: I had to go lookup the meaning of "SHALL" (I now
know it is the same as MUST). I think most RFCs just use MUST these days.
Thanks,
mike
On Thu, Dec 19, 2013 at 8:32 AM, Drak <drak at zikula.org> wrote:
> On 19 December 2013 16:04, Amir Taaki <genjix at riseup.net> wrote:
>
>> About signing each commit, Linus advises against it:
>>
>> http://git.661346.n2.nabble.com/GPG-signing-for-git-commit-td2582986.html
>
>
> Yeah, it makes no sense after reading it. Nice catch.
>
> However, his recommendation for signing tags with `git tag -s` should
> probably be incorporated into the spec as a MUST.
>
> Drak
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
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2023-06-07 15:09:45

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📅 Original date posted:2013-11-15
📝 Original message:It appears that someone is minting new blocks literally every couple of
seconds on the testnet chain right now.
You can see it on both blockexplorer:
http://blockexplorer.com/testnet
and also btclook:
http://testnet.btclook.com/
Is this something we should worry about?
thanks,
Mike
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2023-06-07 15:09:45

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