π
Original date posted:2015-04-08
π Original message:William,
I believe the reasoning for this is stated in the Coin Type section.
"Public derivation is used so that cosigners need only know one of each
other's public keys, rather than needing to distribute public keys for each
coin."
BIP44 has a coin level, but it's a private derived level, so cosigners
would not be able to generate multiple crypto currencies of each others'
without giving each other n xpubs where n is the number of currencies
shared. This new proposal basically sticks coin type on the public
derivation side of things so that I could generate litecoin or darkcoin
multisigs without your permission...
Kefkius,
This BIP seems like a good fit for multi-currency wallets based on
multisig. So kudos for putting it in writing.
However, I don't know if this is really a BIP thing. It's not improving
Bitcoin (Bitcoin Improvement Proposal... remember?), in fact, by definition
it is improving altcoin usability.
For that reason alone I will say I disagree for a BIP for this.
- Jona
2015-04-08 16:46 GMT+09:00 William Swanson <swansontec at gmail.com>:
>
> It's not really clear why this is better than BIP 44 as it already
> stands. You have the same fields, but they are just in a different
> order. Couldn't you just use the existing BIP 44 hierarchy, but add
> the convention that "wallet/account N" is the same wallet in each
> supported currency?
>
> For example, if I have a wallet called "business expenses", which
> happens to be wallet m / 44' / 0' / 5', for Bitcoin, then the same
> wallet would be m / 44' / 3' / 5' for Dogecoin, and m / 44' / 2' / 5'
> for Litecoin.
>
> I am trying to think of examples where your proposal is better than
> BIP 44, but I can't think of any. Even backup recovery works fine. I
> assume that your idea is to continue iterating over the different
> wallet indices as long as you are finding funds in *any* currency.
> Well, you can still do that with BIP 44. The fields are in a different
> order, but that doesn't affect the algorithm in any way.
>
> Maybe you have some deeper insight I'm not seeing, but if so, you need
> to clearly explain that in your motivation section. The current
> explanation, "This limits the possible implementations of
> multi-currency, multisignature wallets," is pretty vauge. Also, there
> is nothing in this spec that addresses the multisignature use-case.
> The BIP 45 spec does a lot of extra work to make multisignature work
> smoothly.
>
> I'm not trying to criticize your proposal. I'm just trying to
> understand what it's trying to accomplish.
>
> -William Swanson
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 12:05 AM, Kefkius <kefkius at maza.club> wrote:
> > I have a potential BIP, "Multi-Currency Hierarchy For Use In
> > Multisignature Deterministic Wallets." I'm requesting discussion on it,
> > and possibly assignment of a BIP number.
> >
> > It's located in this github gist:
> > https://gist.github.com/Kefkius/1aa02945e532f8739023
> >
> >
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > BPM Camp - Free Virtual Workshop May 6th at 10am PDT/1PM EDT
> > Develop your own process in accordance with the BPMN 2 standard
> > Learn Process modeling best practices with Bonita BPM through live
exercises
> > http://www.bonitasoft.com/be-part-of-it/events/bpm-camp-virtual-
event?utm_
> > source=Sourceforge_BPM_Camp_5_6_15&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=VA_SF
> > _______________________________________________
> > Bitcoin-development mailing list
> > Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> BPM Camp - Free Virtual Workshop May 6th at 10am PDT/1PM EDT
> Develop your own process in accordance with the BPMN 2 standard
> Learn Process modeling best practices with Bonita BPM through live
exercises
> http://www.bonitasoft.com/be-part-of-it/events/bpm-camp-virtual-
event?utm_
> source=Sourceforge_BPM_Camp_5_6_15&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=VA_SF
> _______________________________________________
> Bitcoin-development mailing list
> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
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ζ¨γδΈγγγͺ [ARCHIVE] /
npub16eβ¦r69ln
2023-06-07 15:32:20
in reply to nevent1qβ¦s47c
Author Public Key
npub16ecxq9xc02qz8vu442d3mhue6z0r7gmdhe2ls2yze9h7uu3wwncspr69lnPublished at
2023-06-07 15:32:20Event JSON
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"content": "π
Original date posted:2015-04-08\nπ Original message:William,\n\nI believe the reasoning for this is stated in the Coin Type section.\n\n\"Public derivation is used so that cosigners need only know one of each\nother's public keys, rather than needing to distribute public keys for each\ncoin.\"\n\nBIP44 has a coin level, but it's a private derived level, so cosigners\nwould not be able to generate multiple crypto currencies of each others'\nwithout giving each other n xpubs where n is the number of currencies\nshared. This new proposal basically sticks coin type on the public\nderivation side of things so that I could generate litecoin or darkcoin\nmultisigs without your permission...\n\nKefkius,\n\nThis BIP seems like a good fit for multi-currency wallets based on\nmultisig. So kudos for putting it in writing.\n\nHowever, I don't know if this is really a BIP thing. It's not improving\nBitcoin (Bitcoin Improvement Proposal... remember?), in fact, by definition\nit is improving altcoin usability.\n\nFor that reason alone I will say I disagree for a BIP for this.\n- Jona\n\n\n2015-04-08 16:46 GMT+09:00 William Swanson \u003cswansontec at gmail.com\u003e:\n\u003e\n\u003e It's not really clear why this is better than BIP 44 as it already\n\u003e stands. You have the same fields, but they are just in a different\n\u003e order. Couldn't you just use the existing BIP 44 hierarchy, but add\n\u003e the convention that \"wallet/account N\" is the same wallet in each\n\u003e supported currency?\n\u003e\n\u003e For example, if I have a wallet called \"business expenses\", which\n\u003e happens to be wallet m / 44' / 0' / 5', for Bitcoin, then the same\n\u003e wallet would be m / 44' / 3' / 5' for Dogecoin, and m / 44' / 2' / 5'\n\u003e for Litecoin.\n\u003e\n\u003e I am trying to think of examples where your proposal is better than\n\u003e BIP 44, but I can't think of any. Even backup recovery works fine. I\n\u003e assume that your idea is to continue iterating over the different\n\u003e wallet indices as long as you are finding funds in *any* currency.\n\u003e Well, you can still do that with BIP 44. The fields are in a different\n\u003e order, but that doesn't affect the algorithm in any way.\n\u003e\n\u003e Maybe you have some deeper insight I'm not seeing, but if so, you need\n\u003e to clearly explain that in your motivation section. The current\n\u003e explanation, \"This limits the possible implementations of\n\u003e multi-currency, multisignature wallets,\" is pretty vauge. Also, there\n\u003e is nothing in this spec that addresses the multisignature use-case.\n\u003e The BIP 45 spec does a lot of extra work to make multisignature work\n\u003e smoothly.\n\u003e\n\u003e I'm not trying to criticize your proposal. I'm just trying to\n\u003e understand what it's trying to accomplish.\n\u003e\n\u003e -William Swanson\n\u003e\n\u003e\n\u003e On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 12:05 AM, Kefkius \u003ckefkius at maza.club\u003e wrote:\n\u003e \u003e I have a potential BIP, \"Multi-Currency Hierarchy For Use In\n\u003e \u003e Multisignature Deterministic Wallets.\" I'm requesting discussion on it,\n\u003e \u003e and possibly assignment of a BIP number.\n\u003e \u003e\n\u003e \u003e It's located in this github gist:\n\u003e \u003e https://gist.github.com/Kefkius/1aa02945e532f8739023\n\u003e \u003e\n\u003e \u003e\n------------------------------------------------------------------------------\n\u003e \u003e BPM Camp - Free Virtual Workshop May 6th at 10am PDT/1PM EDT\n\u003e \u003e Develop your own process in accordance with the BPMN 2 standard\n\u003e \u003e Learn Process modeling best practices with Bonita BPM through live\nexercises\n\u003e \u003e http://www.bonitasoft.com/be-part-of-it/events/bpm-camp-virtual-\nevent?utm_\n\u003e \u003e source=Sourceforge_BPM_Camp_5_6_15\u0026utm_medium=email\u0026utm_campaign=VA_SF\n\u003e \u003e _______________________________________________\n\u003e \u003e Bitcoin-development mailing list\n\u003e \u003e Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net\n\u003e \u003e https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development\n\u003e\n\u003e\n------------------------------------------------------------------------------\n\u003e BPM Camp - Free Virtual Workshop May 6th at 10am PDT/1PM EDT\n\u003e Develop your own process in accordance with the BPMN 2 standard\n\u003e Learn Process modeling best practices with Bonita BPM through live\nexercises\n\u003e http://www.bonitasoft.com/be-part-of-it/events/bpm-camp-virtual-\nevent?utm_\n\u003e source=Sourceforge_BPM_Camp_5_6_15\u0026utm_medium=email\u0026utm_campaign=VA_SF\n\u003e _______________________________________________\n\u003e Bitcoin-development mailing list\n\u003e Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net\n\u003e https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development\n\n\n\n\n--\n-----BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----\nComment: http://openpgpjs.org\n\nxsBNBFTmJ8oBB/9rd+7XLxZG/x/KnhkVK2WBG8ySx91fs+qQfHIK1JrakSV3\nx6x0cK3XLClASLLDomm7Od3Q/fMFzdwCEqj6z60T8wgKxsjWYSGL3mq8ucdv\niBjC3wGauk5dQKtT7tkCFyQQbX/uMsBM4ccGBICoDmIJlwJIj7fAZVqGxGOM\nbO1RhYb4dbQA2qxYP7wSsHJ6/ZNAXyEphOj6blUzdqO0exAbCOZWWF+E/1SC\nEuKO4RmL7Imdep7uc2Qze1UpJCZx7ASHl2IZ4UD0G3Qr3pI6/jvNlaqCTa3U\n3/YeJwEubFsd0AVy0zs809RcKKgX3W1q+hVDTeWinem9RiOG/vT+Eec/ABEB\nAAHNI2tpbm9zaGl0YSA8a2lub3NoaXRham9uYUBnbWFpbC5jb20+wsByBBAB\nCAAmBQJU5ifRBgsJCAcDAgkQRB9iZ30dlisEFQgCCgMWAgECGwMCHgEAAC6Z\nB/9otobf0ASHYdlUBeIPXdDopyjQhR2RiZGYaS0VZ5zzHYLDDMW6ZIYm5CjO\nFc09ETLGKFxH2RcCOK2dzwz+KRU4xqOrt/l5gyd50cFE1nOhUN9+/XaPgrou\nWhyT9xLeGit7Xqhht93z2+VanTtJAG6lWbAZLIZAMGMuLX6sJDCO0GiO5zxa\n02Q2D3kh5GL57A5+oVOna12JBRaIA5eBGKVCp3KToT/z48pxBe3WAmLo0zXr\nhEgTSzssfb2zTwtB3Ogoedj+cU2bHJvJ8upS/jMr3TcdguySmxJlGpocVC/e\nqxq12Njv+LiETOrD8atGmXCnA+nFNljBkz+l6ADl93jHzsBNBFTmJ9EBCACu\nQq9ZnP+aLU/Rt6clAfiHfTFBsJvLKsdIKeE6qHzsU1E7A7bGQKTtLEnhCCQE\nW+OQP+sgbOWowIdH9PpwLJ3Op+NhvLlMxRvbT36LwCmBL0yD7bMqxxmmVj8n\nvlMMRSe4wDSIG19Oy7701imnHZPm/pnPlneg/Meu/UffpcDWYBbAFX8nrXPY\nvkVULcI/qTcCxW/+S9fwoXjQhWHaiJJ6y3cYOSitN31W9zgcMvLwLX3JgDxE\nflkwq/M+ZkfCYnS3GAPEt8GkVKy2eHtCJuNkGFlCAmKMX0yWzHRAkqOMN5KP\nLFbkKY2GQl13ztWp82QYJZpj5af6dmyUosurn6AZABEBAAHCwF8EGAEIABMF\nAlTmJ9QJEEQfYmd9HZYrAhsMAABKbgf/Ulu5JAk4fXgH0DtkMmdkFiKEFdkW\n0Wkw7Vhd5eZ4NzeP9kOkD01OGweT9hqzwhfT2CNXCGxh4UnvEM1ZMFypIKdq\n0XpLLJMrDOQO021UjAa56vHZPAVmAM01z5VzHJ7ekjgwrgMLmVkm0jWKEKaO\nn/MW7CyphG7QcZ6cJX2f6uJcekBlZRw9TNYRnojMjkutlOVhYJ3J78nc/k0p\nkcgV63GB6D7wHRF4TVe4xIBqKpbBhhN+ISwFN1z+gx3lfyRMSmiTSrGdKEQe\nXSIQKG8XZQZUDhLNkqPS+7EMV1g7+lOfT4GhLL68dUXDa1e9YxGH6zkpVECw\nSpe3vsHZr6CqFg==\n=/vUJ\n-----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----\n-------------- next part --------------\nAn HTML attachment was scrubbed...\nURL: \u003chttp://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/attachments/20150409/a0f5b1a6/attachment.html\u003e",
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