mleku on Nostr: there is a good documentary that examines this called "The Essential Church" which ...

there is a good documentary that examines this called "The Essential Church" which goes through many of the biblical instructions and other related historical cases where the state has gone against the church

i think that 1 Samuel 8 really should end the debate, it's the oldest instruction on the subject and it basically declares that a government (king) is not voluntary and leads to slavery

at best a state is minimally harmful, minimally... not zero... it is the case where by chance the disbelievers choose not to be purely evil but it always leaves a crack open for the Devil to creep in

the debate about the thing is the whole minarchy/constitutionalist argument against decentralised, polycentric law and pure free association

the first pillar of the state is involuntary membership not born of birth and even those bound to family by birth (as per the commandment) are still not bound to be dutiful to a tyrannical family

so, in no case does the authority of God come second to any man made authority, ever

i think the discussions of this in the new testament more are about advising meekness and evasion rather than obedience to the government