matt on Nostr: The main problem I see is that the primary incentive is usually "do it to support the ...
The main problem I see is that the primary incentive is usually "do it to support the network, bro." People are doing what economically makes sense. It doesn't make sense for me to get paid in fiat, have mostly fiat bills, and spend a fee to use Bitcoin, spend a fee to replace the Bitcoin, and then have to live the nightmare of tracking all of the buys and sells for my taxes.
There are so many differences between jurisdictions that there is no single answer to more people spending Bitcoin. The incentive where I live is to spend fiat and save my extra in Bitcoin. I usually have a disincentive to spend and replace. The only time that hasn't been true is when there is a 10% discount on some larger purchase I'm making. Even then, I usually don't want to deal with the tax tracking of it.
This is a multi-faceted issue, but I do agree that more merchants would not solve my issues. I actually don't even need merchant adoption as much as I once did (with all the conversion options). What I need is simpler tax tracking or no taxes at all on Bitcoin for the full economic incentive to bother with spending and replacing.
I donate a lot more Bitcoin than I spend because the tax situation isn't complicated for me when I donate.
I don't think the network is any worse off doing what I do. I'm still pulling value out of the fiat world and putting it into Bitcoin on a regular basis. I'm just not micro transacting myself to death when my reality simply isn't set up for it.
If Bitcoin was legally a currency without taxation, I'd be living completely in it today, even if I lost a percentage for doing so. I would do that on principle. But the amount of work I'd need to do right now is beyond what I am willing to do. There may be ways to make it easier, but not easy enough.
The UX and laws just aren't there for me yet. And this isn't really surprising. The Fiat rails have almost a century on Bitcoin.
We are going the right direction. I'm on more of a Bitcoin standard in my own life than I've ever been, even with how I use it right now.
Like
NVK (nprofile…vu4p) said, we're gonna make it.
I put myself in the camp of those not really willing to use Bitcoin to purchase goods and services, and I agree with saunter (npub1m0s…gcru) that this is a problem. He recently wrote:
> "We have more bitcoin merchants than Bitcoiners willing to spend. We don’t need more merchant adoption, but spenders adoption."
I believe that the "spend-replace" practice needs to be a no-brainer.
I used this approach a couple of times for fairly large purchaes I made. However, it meant that each time I had to complete the BTC payment with my wallet, then move the fiat equivalent of the bitcoin I spent to an exchange, then use that money to purchase BTC at a rate different from the one applied for the initial BTC payment to the merchant, then move the new BTC out of the exchange and back to my wallet.
Of course, this is very annoying and not sensible for small purchases. In those cases, it makes more sense to replace multiple BTC spendings with a single BTC purchase. However, doing this manually and on a regular basis, is going to be complex and time-consuming.
A more convenient solution would be to have your wallet automatically manage the "spend-replace" process in collaboration with services like Relai 🇨🇭 (npub1sqz…vk7v), GetBittr (npub1yad…98zt), bitcoinwell (npub19mf…kfu2), etc.
I could simply receive an alert saying:
"Threshold reached! It's time to replace your Bitcoins!
Transfer xxx EUR/USD to Relai/Bittr/Well/... bank account to purchase approx. YYY BTC that will be received right in this wallet.".
I would immediately switch to a wallet offering this feature!
(/cc Eluc (npub1eaa…54mw), joenakamoto (npub1lr2…dl6a) that recently posted about this topic)
Published at
2024-10-14 10:01:06Event JSON
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"content": "The main problem I see is that the primary incentive is usually \"do it to support the network, bro.\" People are doing what economically makes sense. It doesn't make sense for me to get paid in fiat, have mostly fiat bills, and spend a fee to use Bitcoin, spend a fee to replace the Bitcoin, and then have to live the nightmare of tracking all of the buys and sells for my taxes.\n\nThere are so many differences between jurisdictions that there is no single answer to more people spending Bitcoin. The incentive where I live is to spend fiat and save my extra in Bitcoin. I usually have a disincentive to spend and replace. The only time that hasn't been true is when there is a 10% discount on some larger purchase I'm making. Even then, I usually don't want to deal with the tax tracking of it.\n\nThis is a multi-faceted issue, but I do agree that more merchants would not solve my issues. I actually don't even need merchant adoption as much as I once did (with all the conversion options). What I need is simpler tax tracking or no taxes at all on Bitcoin for the full economic incentive to bother with spending and replacing.\n\nI donate a lot more Bitcoin than I spend because the tax situation isn't complicated for me when I donate.\n\nI don't think the network is any worse off doing what I do. I'm still pulling value out of the fiat world and putting it into Bitcoin on a regular basis. I'm just not micro transacting myself to death when my reality simply isn't set up for it.\n\nIf Bitcoin was legally a currency without taxation, I'd be living completely in it today, even if I lost a percentage for doing so. I would do that on principle. But the amount of work I'd need to do right now is beyond what I am willing to do. There may be ways to make it easier, but not easy enough.\n\nThe UX and laws just aren't there for me yet. And this isn't really surprising. The Fiat rails have almost a century on Bitcoin.\n\nWe are going the right direction. I'm on more of a Bitcoin standard in my own life than I've ever been, even with how I use it right now.\n\nLike nostr:nprofile1qqsw3znfr6vdnxrujezjrhlkqqjlvpcqx79ys7gcph9mkjjsy7zsgygpr9mhxue69uhhqatjv9mxjerp9ehx7um5wghxcctwvsq3samnwvaz7tmjv4kxz7fwdehhxarjd93kztnrdaksz9thwden5te0wfjkccte9ekk7um5wgh8qatz7tvu4p said, we're gonna make it.\n\nnostr:nevent1qqsv9arslqzc35ll8t3lwghcnga0ru6kqrcv00e36fl3jmkp3zhe30spz4mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduhsygpul2qkhdyf97ntaxf6cu4flndmpzdaagx9myq3l5sy6929ghazmypsgqqqqqqs2lwvfs",
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