📅 Original date posted:2012-07-09
📝 Original message:> You are not a developer of any alternative clients
I am and I'm going to have to agree with Greg. Information about clients
is bound to be transient and controversial.
My relatively naive suggestion would be to move it to the Wiki. If it
can handle the controversies involved with the Trade page, it should
easily be able to handle the controversies involved with a Clients page
like this one. A link to that page could be added under Bitcoin Wiki on
Bitcoin.org.
On the subject of randomization, I think that's a bad idea. Randomness
does not equal fairness and more importantly it does not serve the
users, which should be the overriding concern. As a user I don't want to
be recommended a random client but the most sensible choice. As
alternative client implementors we should not be overly concerned about
Bitcoin.org recommending the wrong client, truly good clients will
benefit from word-of-mouth and eventually rise to the top. If you want a
"fair" ordering, then I'd order by number of downloads for downloadable
clients and Alexa rank for any hosted / online services if it were
decided that such should be listed at all.
On 7/9/2012 6:09 PM, Amir Taaki wrote:
> JS randomisation is bad. People shouldn't need JS to view a webpage.
>
> Only you have a problem with this page. I don't see why Bitcoin-Qt needs to be first either when it dominates the front page. It is perfectly fine as it is.
>
> You are not a developer of any alternative clients, and this is a webpage for Bitcoin clients. I have made a change to remove a source of disputes, and make the process more fair and equal. Your suggestion to remove the clients page is your bias towards thinking that there should be only one Bitcoin client that everyone uses (the one which you contribute towards).
>
> If you want to suggest removing the clients page, then fine, lets also remove all reference to Bitcoin-Qt from the front-page and turn it into a http://bittorrent.org/ style website.
>
> Fact is that the other clients are rapidly becoming stable and mature, and the ecosystem is diversifying. The argument that the other clients were not up to scratch held maybe a few months ago, but not now.
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Gregory Maxwell <gmaxwell at gmail.com>
> To: Amir Taaki <zgenjix at yahoo.com>
> Cc: "bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net" <bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net>
> Sent: Monday, July 9, 2012 5:04 PM
> Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] Random order for clients page
>
> On Mon, Jul 9, 2012 at 11:54 AM, Amir Taaki <zgenjix at yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Took me a while, but finally got it working.
>> Entries on the clients page are randomly ordered when the page is generated.
>> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin.org/commit/6850fc8c83494d6ec415ea9d36fb98366373cc03
>> We should regenerate the page every 2 days. This gives fair exposure to all the clients listed.
> If you had authored this as a pull request rather than making the
> change unilaterally I would have recommended leaving it so the
> reference client was always first. I also would have suggested that it
> use JS randomization instead of jekyll in order to get more even
> coverage, though I think thats a more minor point.
>
> Some people were concerned when this page was created that it would
> just be a source of useless disputes. I think its becoming clear that
> this is the case. I think the cost of dealing with this page is
> starting to exceed the benefit it provides and we should probably
> consider removing it.
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Live Security Virtual Conference
> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
> _______________________________________________
> Bitcoin-development mailing list
> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>
Stefan Thomas [ARCHIVE] /
npub1f8…ap20e
2023-06-07 10:21:03
in reply to nevent1q…f068
Author Public Key
npub1f8c8h5evqyy29yp6p7jelyzw6vfwp6jz05exn66l4ygwkj57ytzqmap20ePublished at
2023-06-07 10:21:03Event JSON
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"content": "📅 Original date posted:2012-07-09\n📝 Original message:\u003e You are not a developer of any alternative clients\n\nI am and I'm going to have to agree with Greg. Information about clients\nis bound to be transient and controversial.\n\nMy relatively naive suggestion would be to move it to the Wiki. If it\ncan handle the controversies involved with the Trade page, it should\neasily be able to handle the controversies involved with a Clients page\nlike this one. A link to that page could be added under Bitcoin Wiki on\nBitcoin.org.\n\nOn the subject of randomization, I think that's a bad idea. Randomness\ndoes not equal fairness and more importantly it does not serve the\nusers, which should be the overriding concern. As a user I don't want to\nbe recommended a random client but the most sensible choice. As\nalternative client implementors we should not be overly concerned about\nBitcoin.org recommending the wrong client, truly good clients will\nbenefit from word-of-mouth and eventually rise to the top. If you want a\n\"fair\" ordering, then I'd order by number of downloads for downloadable\nclients and Alexa rank for any hosted / online services if it were\ndecided that such should be listed at all.\n\nOn 7/9/2012 6:09 PM, Amir Taaki wrote:\n\u003e JS randomisation is bad. People shouldn't need JS to view a webpage.\n\u003e\n\u003e Only you have a problem with this page. I don't see why Bitcoin-Qt needs to be first either when it dominates the front page. It is perfectly fine as it is.\n\u003e\n\u003e You are not a developer of any alternative clients, and this is a webpage for Bitcoin clients. I have made a change to remove a source of disputes, and make the process more fair and equal. Your suggestion to remove the clients page is your bias towards thinking that there should be only one Bitcoin client that everyone uses (the one which you contribute towards).\n\u003e\n\u003e If you want to suggest removing the clients page, then fine, lets also remove all reference to Bitcoin-Qt from the front-page and turn it into a http://bittorrent.org/ style website.\n\u003e\n\u003e Fact is that the other clients are rapidly becoming stable and mature, and the ecosystem is diversifying. The argument that the other clients were not up to scratch held maybe a few months ago, but not now.\n\u003e\n\u003e\n\u003e\n\u003e ----- Original Message -----\n\u003e From: Gregory Maxwell \u003cgmaxwell at gmail.com\u003e\n\u003e To: Amir Taaki \u003czgenjix at yahoo.com\u003e\n\u003e Cc: \"bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net\" \u003cbitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net\u003e\n\u003e Sent: Monday, July 9, 2012 5:04 PM\n\u003e Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] Random order for clients page\n\u003e\n\u003e On Mon, Jul 9, 2012 at 11:54 AM, Amir Taaki \u003czgenjix at yahoo.com\u003e wrote:\n\u003e\u003e Took me a while, but finally got it working.\n\u003e\u003e Entries on the clients page are randomly ordered when the page is generated.\n\u003e\u003e https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin.org/commit/6850fc8c83494d6ec415ea9d36fb98366373cc03\n\u003e\u003e We should regenerate the page every 2 days. This gives fair exposure to all the clients listed.\n\u003e If you had authored this as a pull request rather than making the\n\u003e change unilaterally I would have recommended leaving it so the\n\u003e reference client was always first. I also would have suggested that it\n\u003e use JS randomization instead of jekyll in order to get more even\n\u003e coverage, though I think thats a more minor point.\n\u003e\n\u003e Some people were concerned when this page was created that it would\n\u003e just be a source of useless disputes. I think its becoming clear that\n\u003e this is the case. I think the cost of dealing with this page is\n\u003e starting to exceed the benefit it provides and we should probably\n\u003e consider removing it.\n\u003e\n\u003e\n\u003e ------------------------------------------------------------------------------\n\u003e Live Security Virtual Conference\n\u003e Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and \n\u003e threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions \n\u003e will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware \n\u003e threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/\n\u003e _______________________________________________\n\u003e Bitcoin-development mailing list\n\u003e Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net\n\u003e https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development\n\u003e",
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