📅 Original date posted:2015-02-22
📝 Original message:-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
On 02/22/2015 07:50 AM, Matt Whitlock wrote:
> This happened to one of the merchants at the Bitcoin 2013
> conference in San Jose. They sold some T-shirts and accepted
> zero-confirmation transactions. The transactions depended on other
> unconfirmed transactions, which never confirmed, so this merchant
> never got their money.
>
> I keep telling people not to accept transactions with zero
> confirmations, but no one listens.
A better solution is to track the failure rate of zero confirmation
transactions, and adjust prices accordingly to cover the expected loss.
This is what every merchant *already does* since no payment method has
a 0% fraud rate.
Even physical cash has a probability of being counterfeit, and the
prices you pay for things at a convenience store already have that
risk priced in.
The idea that zero confirmation transactions require a 100% guarantee
is a strawman, especially since there exists no number of
confirmations the actually produce a 100% irreversibility guarantee.
Zero confirmation transactions can work as long as the risk of
reversal is measurable and reasonably stable.
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Justus Ranvier [ARCHIVE] /
npub1k2…9qd6m
2023-06-07 15:30:54
in reply to nevent1q…ykmg
Author Public Key
npub1k2eekmevs6gg60df75qpjw4a2atmy89vx28c8zqq5jxy64tuzrws39qd6mPublished at
2023-06-07 15:30:54Event JSON
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"content": "📅 Original date posted:2015-02-22\n📝 Original message:-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----\nHash: SHA1\n\nOn 02/22/2015 07:50 AM, Matt Whitlock wrote:\n\u003e This happened to one of the merchants at the Bitcoin 2013\n\u003e conference in San Jose. They sold some T-shirts and accepted\n\u003e zero-confirmation transactions. The transactions depended on other\n\u003e unconfirmed transactions, which never confirmed, so this merchant\n\u003e never got their money.\n\u003e \n\u003e I keep telling people not to accept transactions with zero\n\u003e confirmations, but no one listens.\n\nA better solution is to track the failure rate of zero confirmation\ntransactions, and adjust prices accordingly to cover the expected loss.\n\nThis is what every merchant *already does* since no payment method has\na 0% fraud rate.\n\nEven physical cash has a probability of being counterfeit, and the\nprices you pay for things at a convenience store already have that\nrisk priced in.\n\nThe idea that zero confirmation transactions require a 100% guarantee\nis a strawman, especially since there exists no number of\nconfirmations the actually produce a 100% irreversibility guarantee.\n\nZero confirmation transactions can work as long as the risk of\nreversal is measurable and reasonably stable.\n-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----\n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\n1nhyoqk+scfLpo7vd6Ke\n=fVAx\n-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----\n-------------- next part --------------\nA non-text attachment was scrubbed...\nName: 0xEAD9E623.asc\nType: application/pgp-keys\nSize: 17528 bytes\nDesc: not available\nURL: \u003chttp://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/attachments/20150222/8dc7c47e/attachment.bin\u003e",
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